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Delusional left attemps to implicate Chinese government in UNPROVEN Russian-hacking hysteria

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posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 09:45 AM
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SOURCE: www.democraticunderground.com...

SOURCE 2: patribotics.blog...


Both Xi and Putin talked extensively about global power moving from a Unipolar World (read US leadership) to a Multi Polar World (Russia & China leading with some minor other players). Both men made it clear they were against what they saw as American values (liberal Democracy) being pushed unfettered around the world. They saw these values as neither universal nor applicable to them or their Governments.


What? You're now accusing China/Russia (who historically mistrust one another to degress of paranoid rivaled only by the Russia-conspiracy theories)

These rabid hypotheses/conspiracy theories can be reduced to one logical device: Occam's razor. Occam's razor is defined as:
The principle can be interpreted as stating Among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected.

Who wants to count how many assumptions/complex conspiracy theories one must now entertain to believe a shred of information from this Russia """investigation""" farce?

So let me get this straight again... It is hard to keep up with the ridiculous number of goal-post movements.

Russia involved? Check
Trump involved? Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.
Hundreds of congressmen involved? Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.
Hundreds of federal agents involved? Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.
American voters involved? Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.
State voting staff? Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.
China? Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.
US corporations? Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.
Alex Jones? Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.
Talk radio? Check. Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.
Citizens expressing legitimate and very valid opinions on Twitter? Also Russian-Soviet-Kremlin spies.

And this is only the tip of their paranoia iceberg. Sadly, not a single one of "them" has offered any evidence to back up their outlandish, hysterical and frankly worrying claims.

Generally, a mass-delusion this far along never ends well for the deluded. They are in for a large emotional crash once reality sinks in: That these claims are outlandish, entirely unsubstantiated and frankly not true (as a default position - presumptive innocence). You actually have to present evidence of your claims, that is how the burden of proof works.

Anti's need not reply (although you're free to). I won't argue with a brick wall. What I will do is continue to present facts, logical arguments and demand you and everyone else present evidence when making claims (otherwise, it is safe to completely ignore you/your claims)

Thanks for your time.

I pray for my fellow Americans who have let their own personal bias, vitriol and wishful thinking cloud their judgment/rational thinking abilities in such a profound way. Democrat leaders must be held accountable for their information warfare against US citizens, their exploitation of our citizens' fears/insecurities and their malicious use of propaganda techniques pioneered by the likes of Nazi Germany and other dictatorial regimes.

Democrat lawmakers must be taken to task for all of their grandiose and highly improbable claims. They've presented zero evidence backing up any of their statements/claims. In fact, every single claim they've made takes several large & important logical leaps to actually be believable. This is willful ignorance, coupled with wishful thinking coupled with vengeful sycophancy.



Dr. Gorka and former SAC Jim Kallstrom explain typical information warfare techniques that are being used against the American people. This is run-of-the-mill/SOP for nation-states and has been going on for years. What is unusual is that these techniques would be applied by one of our political parties (which is not a government agency by any stretch of the imagination...) against the American people, domestically. Information warfare is nevertheless warfare, and therefore its highly unusual to see this private political party engaging in such activities. Even more disturbing is their intent: to subvert a sitting President, lawfully installed and duly elected by the electoral college at the direction of the People.

I say Repubs (who hold all power in government) should start returning the favor, in kind.

edit on 2/14/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 10:07 AM
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I'm already convinced the MSM and some hard core democrats hate America and its people that love it and are actively seeking ways to destroy the country's foundations and sow discord/chaos.

I'm truely befuddled some of these tactics haven't gone in the categories of sedition and treason yet. Or is it being glossed over as simply political football?

No doubt the same comments can be said of members on the conservative side. Establishment scum
edit on 14-2-2018 by WarPig1939 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 10:36 AM
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Petro-Yuan



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 10:37 AM
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a reply to: JBurns




Sadly, not a single one of "them" has offered any evidence to back up their outlandish, hysterical and frankly worrying claims.


And now we even have folks like George W. coming out of the woodworks to declare that "There is evidence that the Russians meddled with the 2016 election"... without providing any insights as to what that evidence is [I'm sure it must be because that evidence is related to national security and they cannot disclose it...]


Pathetic.

Oh, and how about this:

US Officials Won’t Say if a New Anti–Russia Propaganda Project Is Targeting Americans



edit on 14-2-2018 by FamCore because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 10:41 AM
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a reply to: JBurns


Uh, should I bother reading this? the first thing I did was look at your sources.






posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 10:49 AM
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a reply to: JBurns


Okay, I read it, so you are saying the Russians are not interfering in our elections, yo, wake up call they did and are going to do it again....here is a thread I made yesterday about it.

The media is only reporting what our intelegence is saying.

Tuesday's hearing touched on a wide array of threats, from North Korea to China to weapons of mass destruction. But Russia's interference into US and other elections loomed large amid the committee's investigation into Russian election meddling and the Trump campaign's possible collusion with Russian officials.




www.cnn.com...


www.abovetopsecret.com...



"Frankly, the United States is under attack," Director of National Intelligence Dan Coats told the Senate Intelligence Committee, adding that Russia is attempting to "degrade our democratic values and weaken our alliances."


www.usatoday.com...



edit on 14-2-2018 by kurthall because: add link



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 10:53 AM
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a reply to: FamCore

Fancy bear and cozy bear. Research them.



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 11:22 AM
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So now Never Trump lost the last election because of some Sino Russian machination!

They need to give it up already.

They're looking bat snip crazy all the more.



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 11:55 AM
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originally posted by: neo96


So now Never Trump lost the last election because of some Sino Russian machination!

They need to give it up already.

They're looking bat snip crazy all the more.

Most of the very same people suddenly decided that North Korea is a wonderful place, just because Mike Pence was sitting in the same box as Kim Jong Un's sister. They reached "bat snip crazy" quite a while ago, and are now working toward "straight jacket in a padded room."
edit on 14-2-2018 by AndyFromMichigan because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:19 PM
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originally posted by: AndyFromMichigan

originally posted by: neo96


So now Never Trump lost the last election because of some Sino Russian machination!

They need to give it up already.

They're looking bat snip crazy all the more.

Most of the very same people suddenly decided that North Korea is a wonderful place, just because Mike Pence was sitting in the same box as Kim Jong Un's sister. They reached "bat snip crazy" quite a while ago, and are now working toward "straight jacket in a padded room."


Indeed


Or their unwavering excuses for Venezuela dictator Maduro (socialist commie) and Cuba's Castro. Remember the US President offering his condolences for Castro? Meanwhile, Americans were celebrating the death of a brutal dictator that was a long-standing target on our kill list.



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:23 PM
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a reply to: Sillyolme


Intimately familiar with them already. I study government spyware/malware as a hobby. The existence of "Russian" hacking groups does not prove anything. Could've just as easily been NK, China, Cuba, UK, or any other ideologically insane dictatorship. As we've all seen by Shadow Broker leaks and WikiLeaks data, CIA/NSA (and non-state actors) can easily implicate any nation they want in cyber activities. They simply spoof IP addresses, leave some commented code in a foreign language and have it C4ISTAR with a compromised server in target nation. Easy, peasy.

The fact Russia has APT groups isn't surprising. Research "Equation Group" "Shadow Brokers" "Cicada 3301" and "Jester Actual"

I'd be more surprised if a nation-state didn't have off-record APT groups (like NSA TAO)

You do realize this type of standard intelligence activity is a standard and highly common practice, right? There is nothing new. We interfere in elections/domestic affairs of other nations, and they do it back to us. No biggie.

The real issue is a certain chunk of this population's vulnerability to misinformation/propaganda techniques. The reason behind this is that our own government uses these techniques to influence us (to very similar ends as foreign enemies). Teaching the bulk population counter-measures and detection techniques would make too much sense, though. Oh, and not to mention destroy US domestic propaganda arm(s) (IE: Voice of America, MSM, Hollywood, etc)

STILL haven't produced any of that evidence though................ I'll wait.

edit on 2/14/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:29 PM
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I have to ask why they are dangerous or outlandish?

Do you honestly think neither China nor Russia are trying to subvert the US power and supplant with their own? Have you never seen the enormous volume of hacking traffic deriving from China?

I mean, i get that you have some cynicism derived from political partisan hysteria...but come on man. What you are denying here is something that 2 years ago was a mainstay here on ATS. What you are denying are instances where we have caught China red handed.



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:32 PM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: FamCore

Fancy bear and cozy bear. Research them.



I've researched that fiasco.

It seems to me that Crowdstrike is among the least reliable sources in the entire affair. I can dig up the proven example of Crowdstrike completely blowing it right after they were called in to make up nonsense for the DNC.

There is a reason we have law enforcement to investigate crime. Its so private firms like Crowdstrike don't destroy or conflate evidence.



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:42 PM
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This is the second comment on DU,,,



2. Patribotics Blog pushes too much right-wing propaganda and conspiracy.

Much as some of us might just love conspiracy theories, let's say a big no to right-wing sources, even, or especially, if they seem to currently be pushing messages appealing to some left-wingers.

Who is this "Andrew Evans Peter" from Australia?

I can't anything about him except his own tweets. Certainly no reputable sources are quoting him.


But keep shouting we're the delusional ones, as you chow down on any piece of excretion from your owners.

K~



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:45 PM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan


Of course they are engaging in these activities, as I've written I don't dispute that.


What I dispute entirely is the grandiose, complex and entirely unsubstantiated proposition that it is some type of vast internal conspiracy, when the allegations are clearly being used as political cannon fodder against Trump. When a segment of society is attempting to implicate the WH, Congress, federal agencies, voters, as well as a host of foreign nations in some complex but unproven scheme I think it is cause for concern

Sorry, but such claims bring back memories of Hillary's past grandiose and unproven claims of "conspiracies" against her (despite being largely unpopular, and a "dud" candidate). From the "Vast Right-wing conspiracy" to the private server containing SCI outside of a SCIF (SCIF is the sole authorized location for storing/handling SCI national defense material). Clinton and her sycophants have cried wolf one too many times. We shouldn't allow ourselves to make the same ungodly mistake we did on 9/11. Evidence must be demanded, no longer can any of us afford to take anybody else on their "good word" alone. Too many liars/propagandists out there to ever consider that

I would like to point out that those making these accusations have presented precisely zero evidence implicating the President in any crime. Furthermore, I contend that their activities fall within the scope of standard SOP for nation state intelligence activities.

There is nothing any more unusual about this than there was 1, 5 or 10 years ago IMHO. It absolutely needs to be dealt with, but the way this segment of society wants to go about that is frankly incorrect. This is an intelligence matter, not the criminal issue they've wrongfully spun it into (which is IMO retaliation for Hillary's staggering loss, despite having the entire establishment behind her)

They have been focusing on the wrong aspects of this. Instead of acknowledging disinformation for what it is, they'd rather peddle this "Russian invasion" red-dawn-esque theory about deep subversion within the WH/GOP/Alternative news media/anyone not parroting Dem talking points on social media than face the reality. The reality is that our own domestic propaganda (preventing proper education against this attack vector) is coming home to roost along with our decades-old policy of foreign internal affairs interference

This government must cease its lying-as-a-matter-of-policy to the People of this nation before we can ever hope to combat misinformation. It is my hope they realize the fact that it is our own IC that is causing the problems. Much like cyber-security, where US IC withholds critical vulnerability patches in order to exploit US citizens/foreign targets they are withholding crucial propaganda/disinfo/INFOWAR countermeasures in order to preserve their own techniques for continued use against US citizens/foreign targets.


edit on 2/14/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:45 PM
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a reply to: aethertek


I cited Dem Underground to specifically present the other side. Nice try though...

Typically when I present content from their site I disagree with/am critiquing, I censor the website name/poster information (check my previous topics). I did not do that because I specifically wanted that POV to be presented, showing there are plenty of reasonable people on the "left"

This was an 'attack' on that blog's message specifically, and those pushing such theory. Many posters on DU responded in a (thankfully) skeptical way.

So many Dems have already determined us "Repubs" are Satan himself (I'm actually an Indy, switched from Dem who votes Rep...but understandable mistake). Fortunately, not everybody fails to make the distinction between person and party and judge each individual on their own merits/ideas and most importantly ACTIONS
edit on 2/14/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:46 PM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: FamCore

Fancy bear and cozy bear. Research them.


Made-up stories πŸ˜†

5πŸ‘β€πŸ‘πŸ‘πŸ‘πŸ‘2Kings



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:47 PM
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a reply to: xuenchen


FVEY



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:54 PM
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a reply to: JBurns
Spare me your BS, go to any any right-wing site & it reads like a bunch of retarded raper skinheads on crack.

But keep pushing your drivel, apparently it's all you have to live for.

K~



posted on Feb, 14 2018 @ 12:58 PM
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a reply to: aethertek


Stop it. You're going to make me blush.


Apparently you haven't realized the old adage.... "sticks and stones may break my bones, but insults, anger and feigned outrage won't prove criminal allegations"

Star is from me, BTW.
edit on 2/14/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)




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